从这里了解印度人对中国的看法

印度时报编辑纳格:印度是否是中国的殖民地

2012-04-27 23:44 41个评论 字号:

2012年4月25日,一名叫做纳格的印度时报编辑发表了一篇题为《印度是否是中国殖民地》的博文,称印度向中国出口的产品主要是铁矿石等原材料和低价值产品,而中国向印度出口成品。纳格称中印贸易对印度越来越不利,中印贸易模式类似帝国和殖民地之间的贸易模式。何谓殖民地?殖民地是指由宗主国统治,没有政治、经济、军事和外交方面的独立权利,完全受宗主国控制的地区。然而,有的印度网民称出口原材料和进口成品的国家就是殖民地。

原文标题:Is India a colony of China?
原文链接:http://blogs.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/masala-noodles/entry/is-india-a-colony-of-china2

印度人看1962年中印战争:1962年中印战争

中印关系插曲:1962年中印战争(三泰虎配图)

There is nothing known as a Chinese East India Company, but the pattern of trade between India and China is fast taking the shape that trade between India and England was when the London headquartered East India Company was exploiting the resources of India in the 18th and 19th century.

China is today the largest trade partner of India and the pattern of this trade between the two countries is such as would be between an imperial power and its colony. In fact with the passage of every year, the India – China trade balance is turning more adverse for India. In 2011, the adverse trade balance had risen to 27.08 billion US $, up from 20.82 billion US $ in 2010 and 15.87 billion US $ in 2009. The total trade between the two countries in 2011 was $ 74 billion.

世界上没有什么中国人的东印度公司,但是中印贸易模式正快速转变成18世纪和19世纪期间总部在伦敦的东印度公司剥削印度资源时的英印贸易模式。

中国今天是印度最大的贸易伙伴。两国之间的贸易模式将会类似帝国和殖民地之间的贸易模式。事实上,在过去的每一年里,中印贸易平衡对印度越来越不利。贸易逆差从2010年的208.2亿美元和2009年的158.7亿美元,上升到2011年的270.8亿美元。两国2011年的总贸易额是740亿美元。

India’s largest export to China is iron ore, which the Chinese use to produce steel. Using ore from India as also Australia and Brazil, China produces 630 million tons of steel, which is nearly 44 per cent of the world’s steel output. This steel is used to build the infrastructure of China, which in turn goes to make it a mighty nation. That might is used to threaten and blackmail other countries including India. More of this later in this piece.

The other exports of India include low price yielding commodities and primary products like copper, salt, sugar, vegetable oil and leather but there is also cotton yarn and electric machinery. But Indian companies are crying hoarse that the Chinese ease restriction of entry of Indian pharmaceuticals and IT. On paper, Chinese exports to India include fertilizers, vehicles, furniture, prefab buildings and manmade filaments. But anybody with a discerning eye and staying in India knows that the Chinese products of all sizes and dimensions have flooded the markets in India. This could include even include Kutchi handicrafts, kites, lanterns and hospital beds. It now seems that some Chinese companies want to set up units in Indian Special Economic Zones (SEZs) to be closer to the Indian markets so that they can exploit it more effectively.

印度向中国出口最多的是中国人用于生产钢铁的铁矿石。中国利用印度、澳大利亚和巴西的铁矿石生产6.3亿吨钢铁,占了世界钢铁产量的近一半。这些钢铁被中国用于修建让国家变得强大的基础设施。强大的国力可能被用于威胁和敲诈包括印度在内的其他国家。后面还会提到这点。

印度的其他出口包括低价值商品和大宗产品,比如铜、糖类、植物油和皮革,此外还有棉纱和电动机。印度公司大声疾呼,要求中国人放宽印度药品和IT的进口限制。从账面上来看,中国人向印度出口的产品包括化肥、汽车、家具、预制板房和人造长丝纤维等。但是明眼人和身处印度的人都知道各种各样的中国货充斥着印度市场。可能包括库奇工艺品、风筝、灯笼和医院病床。似乎某些中国公司如今想在印度经济特区设点,为的是更加靠近印度市场,从而更有效的剥削印度。

The trade balance between India and China would have been even more adverse to India had not the Supreme Court stepped in last year and banned exports of iron ore from Karnataka. Bellary district of Karnataka popularly called the Republic of Bellary where the writ of the Gali brothers reigned supreme and the Indian government was all but absent – is the place from iron ore was being mined both legally and illegally – and exported to China through various ports of south India. Gali Janardan Reddy has now been incarcerated and there has been a massive crackdown on mining. This has brought down the exports of iron ore to China. But not before the Chinese have made substantial use of the Indian raw materials to build its massive infrastructure in the last few years.Increased consciousness in the security establishment of India has led to a higher export duty on iron ore and also increased railway freight rates for transporting iron ore. This has also contributed to the falling exports from last year.

如果最高法院没有介入和禁止卡纳塔克邦的铁矿石出口,那么中印贸易平衡对印度更加不利。卡纳塔克邦贝拉里地区一般被称为贝拉里共和国。咖里兄弟在那里处于最高统治地位,而印度政府毫无影响力。正是贝拉里地区的铁矿石被合法或者非法开采,然后通过印度南部各港口出口到中国。咖里·加纳德·雷迪如今已经被监禁。采矿受到大规模镇压,导致向中国出口铁矿石下降。但是它并没有发生在中国人这几年大量使用印度原材料修建基础设施之前。印度安全部门不断提高的意识导致铁矿石出口税提高,也导致铁矿石的铁路运输价格上升和去年出口的下降。

But the counter lobby that seeks more exports of iron ore from India is strong: they are calling for renewed iron ore exports from India to China. They point out how the revenues of some railway zone like South Western Railway based in Hubli has been affected by the curb on exports. They also argue that the livelihood of many engaged in the mining and transportation related activities have been affected too. Representatives of the lobby also contend that India has a huge reserve of iron ore and it does not matter that if some of it is exported to China. They, of course miss the point that besides strengthening the hands of China it also was fuelling illegal incomes in India. A large part of this money was going into politics to subvert the process of democracy in India. A politically weaker India would be a perfect breeding ground for China to exploit more of India’s resources.

但是那些寻求印度出口更多铁矿石的反对游说团体是强大的。他们要求印度恢复对中国的铁矿石出口。他们指出,某些铁路属区的税收受到出口限制的影响,比如总部在哈里的西南铁路局。他们也辩称,许多从事采矿业和运输业等相关活动的人的生计也受到影响。游说团体的代表主张称,印度有巨大的铁矿石储备,向中国出口一些铁矿石并无大碍。当然,他们没有抓住问题的关键,除了加强了中国的力量,也助长了印度的非法收入。相当一部分非法收入被用于颠覆印度的皿煮进程。政治软弱的印度将是中国剥削印度更多资源的温床。

Remember this is the way through which the English entered India.

Not surprisingly the Chinese have also been lobbying hard so that exports of iron ore can be increased from India. They are lamenting that if Indian exports cannot be raised then they would have to scour new sources in Africa other than increasing dependence on Australia and Brazil. The Chinese ambassador to India is quoted recently as saying: “Our market (for iron ore) is always open for India.”

记住,这是英语进入印度的方式。

并不吃惊的是,为了让印度提高铁矿石出口,中国人也努力游说。他们惋惜地称,如果印度不提高出口,那么他们将在非洲寻找新的来源,而不是提高对澳大利亚和巴西的依赖。有报告援引中国驻印大使的话称:“我们的(铁矿石)市场一直向印度敞开。”

But behind this all is the mailed fist of the Chinese. These days the Chinese are quite vociferous about India exploring for oil and gas in the South China Sea. After an agreement with the Vietnam in 2006, ONGC Videsh – the offshore wing of the public sector company ONGC – is prospecting for two blocks in the Sea. But the Chinese are protesting claiming that they have territorial rights over the waters, which is off the coast of Vietnam. Beijing has declared that: India will have to pay a heavy price for exploring in the disputed waters of South China Sea. Not only oil exploration, the Chinese have also objected to the presence of an Indian naval ship on a good will mission to Vietnam in the South China Sea. In July 2011, INS Airavat on a friendly visit to Vietnam was contacted 45 nautical miles off the coast and threatened by the Chinese.

但是一切的背后是中国人的武力威胁。中国人这些天对印度开发南海石油天然气大声喧嚣。国有的印度石油天然气公司(ONGC)的外国子公司——ONGC Videsh在2006年和越南签署协议后,正在南海的两块区域勘探。但是中国人抗议称他们对这块海域拥有主权。北京宣称:印度将为南海争议地区的石油开发付出沉重代价。不仅是石油开发,中国人也反对印度海军军舰在南海“友好”访问越南。2011年7月,“艾拉瓦特”号(INS Airavat)“友好”访问越南,在离海岸45海里处受到中国人的威胁。

(三泰虎注:“艾拉瓦特”号是一艘印度海军两栖攻击舰)

There have been more serious transgressions by the Chinese in recent years. When Prime Minister Manmohan Singh went to Arunachal Pradesh in 2009 to campaign for the polls, ludicrous that it may sound, the Chinese objected! “We are strongly dissatisfied with the visit to the disputed region by the Indian leader,” the Chinese posted on their foreign ministry website. For those who came in late, the Chinese have been claiming Arunachal Pradesh to be their own and have even named it as South Tibet. It is a different matter that the Chinese have gobbled up Tibet and made it their own after throwing out the Dalai Lama.

中国人最近几年还有更多严重的侵犯。当辛格总理2009年到“阿鲁纳恰尔邦”为竞选拉票的时候,听起来可能荒唐的是中国人对此表示反对!中国人在外交部网站上发文称:“我们对印度领导人访问争议地区表示强烈不满。”中国人声称“阿鲁纳恰尔邦”是自己的领土,甚至将其称为藏南。这和中国人在驱逐光头后吞下xz是两码事。

Now through Tibet, the Chinese want to control the whole of Asia. Tibet, the plateau high up in the Himalayas is the place from where all the major rivers of Asia originate. This includes the Brahmaputra, Indus, Sutlej and the Yangtze, Yellow and Mekong rivers. The Chinese are now damming the Brahmaputra (called Tsang Po in Tibet) to supply waters not only to Tibet but also other parts of China. They are also seeking to divert the waters of the Brahmaputra to the Xinjiang province of China. It is also learnt that one of the dams on the Brahmaputra called the Dagmu dam will produce power that will not only serve Guangdong but also can be sold to Myanmar, Thailand, Bangladesh and Laos. The last four countries are also at the mercy of China because the latter have been building dams on the upper reaches of the Mekong that is affecting water flow of the river downstream.

中国人现在想通过xz控制整个亚洲。青藏高原是亚洲所有主要河流的发源地,包括雅鲁藏布江、印度河、萨特累季河、长江、黄河和湄公河。中国人如今在雅鲁藏布江筑坝,不仅为xz供水,而且为中国其他地方供水。他们也力图将雅鲁藏布江的水引入中国xj。据悉雅鲁藏布江上的其中一个大坝将不仅为广东省供电,也将向缅甸、泰国、孟加拉国和老挝出口。这四个国家也任凭中国摆布,因为中国也在湄公河上游筑坝,影响到下游的水量。

Mekong, happens to be the lifeline of Indo China. Needless to add the damming of Brahmaputra in many places in Tibet will lead to water shortages in Assam and Bangladesh. This is a real possibility that should not be discounted.

In the ultimate analysis this is the reason that China does not let go off Tibet. The Chinese have denied the Tibetans their human rights but want to use the resources of their land to increase their strength and lord it over the rest of Asia including India. But except for the Indian security and foreign establishment a large part of opinion makers are oblivious of the Chinese threat to India which is now not only military but also economic. There is much ecstasy in Indian business circles about growing Indo- China business relationship oblivious to the dangers of this relationship. Indo Chinese friendship societies have also sprouted in many cities in India. If in the good old days only the CPM cadres were the fans of China, the fan following has now extended to large sections of small, medium and big businessmen who do not understand the perils of greater engagement with China.

湄公河碰巧是印度支那的生命线。不用说也知道,在雅鲁藏布江上筑许多大坝会导致阿萨姆邦和孟加拉邦缺水。这是不应该被低估的现实可能。

归根到底,这是中国不放弃xz的原因。中国人想要用这块土地的资源来提高自己力量和对包括印度在内的亚洲其他国家发号施令。但是除了印度安全部门和外交部门,大部分舆论明显认为中国人不仅在军事上对印度具有威胁,而且在经济上也是。印度商业圈对中印商业关系的发展狂喜,全然不知这种关系的危害。中印友好也在印度许多城市迅速燎原。如果是在过去的好时光里,只有印度gcd干部才是中国迷,那么如今中国迷扩大到许多不理解中印更大接触将带来的危害的商人。

以下是印度网民的评论:

jasonsaps (vadodara, gujarat)

April 25,2012 at 11:52 PM IST

Mr Nag … Although i do agree with some of your points, but please enlighten us .. .who is stopping India to use her own iron-ore to build massive infrastructure … huh? If Chinese can take advantage of SEZ to be closer to Indian market than who is stopping Indian businesses to do the same using our own SEZs? Is it even a point to complain that they sell us Kutchi handicrafts, kites, lanterns and hospital beds. Who is stopping us to do the same…? I am not a fan of China but how long we would keep on complaining and not take up the challenge … Who’s stopping us …. oh wait …

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纳格先生…虽然我同意你的某些观点,但是请给我们开导一下…谁阻止印度利用自己的铁矿石大规模修建基础设施…嗯?如果中国人可以利用印度经济特区而离印度市场更近,那么是谁阻止印度企业如此效仿?抱怨他们向我们出售库奇工艺品、风筝、灯笼和医院病床是否有意义。谁阻止我们那样做…?我不是中国迷,但是我们要抱怨多久,我们要多久才能迎接挑战…是谁在阻止我们…哦,等等…

(Reply to jasonsaps)- SR (Canada) says:
April 26,2012 at 07:27 AM IST
Incompetent government at centre is stopping us. In today’s climate of free market economy, there is no point in complaining about China leaping forward and capturing Indian markets. Only solution is for the government to wake up from the deep slumber and become pro-active. Support local industries and develop infrastructure- just like Modi is doing in Gujarat.
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是无能的中央政府阻止我们。在今天自由市场经济的氛围下,抱怨中国快速发展和夺取印度市场毫无意义。唯一的解决办法是政府从沉睡中醒来和变得积极主动。支持当地产业和发展基础设施——就像穆迪在古吉拉特邦做的那样。

(Reply to SR)- Indi (Maharashtra) says:
April 26,2012 at 11:33 AM IST
Modi is doing a good job in helping Gujus obtain green Cards.
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穆迪在帮助古吉拉特人获得绿卡上做得不错。

(Reply to Indi)- SR (Canada) says:
April 26,2012 at 08:30 PM IST
Gujus spread to whole world before Modi was even born and will continue going to other parts of world even when he won’t be around. Only people like you who cannot see and are opposed to the good things Modi has done for Gujarat and will continue doing.
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古吉拉特人在穆迪出生前就散布到整个世界,并且在穆迪死后也会继续扩散到世界其他地方。只有你那样的人才会对穆迪为古吉拉特邦所做的好事视而不见甚至表示反对…

(Reply to jasonsaps)- NE (Imphal) says:
April 26,2012 at 05:16 PM IST
many companies in Gujarat are taking help from china consultancy…they import the whole materials from there and set it up…it also happens in other states if u will check…BHEL doesn’t have enough manpower to take the orders from all these companies and so they take help mainly from China…it is not always the government…we simply do not have enterprises who can help set up companies
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古吉拉特邦的许多公司接受中国咨询公司的帮助…他们从那里整套进口,然后建立起来…如果你查一查,其他邦也是如此…印度巴拉特重型电气有限公司(BHEL)没有足够的人力来接那些公司的所有订单,所以他们主要从中国那里获得帮助…并不总是政府的原因…我们没有能够帮助建立公司的企业。

(Reply to jasonsaps)- indian (indian) says:
April 26,2012 at 08:50 PM IST
thats coz we only know how to complain. here people will not do their job well unless u bribe them n also not let others do their job well. Unless u pay them to leave u alone.
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那是因为我们只知道如何抱怨。除非你贿赂他们,否则这里的人不会好好办事。此外,这里的人也不让其他人办好份内事。除非你给钱,他们才会放过你。

Vidya bhopi (Usa) says:
April 26,2012 at 04:41 AM IST
i have always feared one day this would happen. It’s high time we wake up
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我一直害怕这个某天会发生。我们早该觉醒了。

RN (canada) says:
April 26,2012 at 06:09 AM IST
He is absolutely right. Nobody is stopping India from using its iron ore to build its infrastructure. The problem with India is the lack of shared perspective and the lack of a sense of national collective good. Not only politicians but Indians too. In several countries I visited Indians are viewed as crude, uncouth and arrogant…….
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他是完全正确的。没人阻止印度利用自己的铁矿石来修建基础设施。印度的问题在于缺少共同的观点和国家集体荣誉感。不仅是政客,印度人也是如此。在我访问过的几个国家中,印度人被认为粗鲁、笨拙和傲慢…

madav (india) says: [Is India a colony of China? : India : Kingshuk Nag : TOI Blogs]
April 26,2012 at 08:43 AM IST
our politician will sell their wife or mother to anybody if they get ton crores of money… stupid politician, paid news to support these politicians by media, our general public stupid knowledge of what is india( i think indians are divided in ourselves) thackrey marathis , kannada rowdies,malayali mafia,bengali self pride, ignorant people,nobody is thinking or behaving as a indian….. treat everyone as a indian, whether he is a assamese, kashmiris, tamilan,bihari, …. first be united… fear is the most powerful weapon of all(toi never spread awareness in people , they are good only in spreading rumours n fears)….
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为了获得巨额资金,我们的政客会出卖自己的老婆或者老母…愚蠢的政客,媒体发布支持政客的有偿新闻。我们普通大众的愚蠢认知是印度人分为马拉地人、坎那达人、马拉雅拉姆黑手党、孟加拉人。没有人是以印度人的方式思考或者行动…不管他是阿萨姆人、克什米尔人、泰米尔人、比哈尔人…应该将其当做印度人看待…首先应该团结…恐惧是最强大的武器(印度时报从来没有在人们当中宣传认识,他们只擅长散步谣言和恐惧)…

Umesh (delhi) says:
April 26,2012 at 10:14 AM IST
I am working in a Chinese company and more than 500 Chinese are working here(more than Indians Working Here,it’s a thermal power project ) in 2 years of my working period i have seen how they play with INDIAN laws ( with the help of INDIANS) from local Police Chief to Politicians everybody is helping them just for money .
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我在一家中国公司工作。有超过500名中国人在这里工作(比在这里工作的印度人多,是一个火电项目)。在我工作的2年期间,我看到他们是如何(在印度人的帮助下)玩弄印度法律。从当地警察局局长到政客,大家都为了钱而帮助他们。

原创翻译:三泰虎 http://www.santaihu.com

R.Kannan (Ahmedabad) says:
April 26,2012 at 11:18 AM IST
What Nag fails to explain is how the various govt’s economic policies are designed to be aginst indian interests. If iron ore is available in excess, what has stopped India from converting it to steel ? If Chinese are able to become the factory of the world, it is because their economic policies are designed to do so. India has suffered mainly because the national economic policy is designed to protect special intrests rather than benefit the average Indian. Even now, the biggest concern in Delhi is how to help Pakistan by extending all types of benefits to them without insisting on reciprocity.

If, as Nag claims, Indian companies in IT & Pharma sector cannot operate in China, it would be simple for Indian govt to take retaliatory measures , especially as it would hurt China more due to balance of trade issue. Unfortunately, we need to recognise that red tape & infrastructural constraints in India are holding the nation back but this appears to be the desire of all indian governments since independence.
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纳格先生没有解释的是政府制定的各项经济政策是如何和印度人的利益相悖。如果铁矿石过剩,那是什么阻止印度将其转化成钢铁?如果中国人能够成为世界工厂,那是因为他们的经济政策就是如此制定的。印度之所以遭困,主要是因为国家经济政策的目的在于保护特殊利益,而不是让普通印度人受惠。甚至在现在,德里的主要关注点是如何通过给以各种利益来帮助巴基斯坦,而不是坚持互惠互利的政策。

如果正像纳格所声称的,印度IT和制药业的公司无法在中国运作,那么很简单,印度政府可以采取报复措施,特别是由于贸易不平衡,它将对中国造成伤害。不幸地是,我们需要承认的是印度的繁文缛节和基础设施阻碍国家的发展。但是,这似乎是印度独立以来所有政府的愿望。

deepak (ahmedabad) says:
April 26,2012 at 12:19 PM IST
we should not blame china for everything, we have to learn a lesson from 1962 and the way british people did decades ago. our democratic system is failure. our leaders are diverting our attention towards pakistan, but we have to be more careful towards china.
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我们不应该将一切归咎于中国。我们必须从1962年(中印战争)和英国人几十年前所做的事情中吸取教训。我们的皿煮体制是个败笔。我们的领导人将我们的注意力引向巴基斯坦。但是我们必须对中国更加小心。

Rakesh Katyal (Delhi) says:
April 26,2012 at 02:48 PM IST
Mr Nag how can you write an article without mention of Narender Modi. I think this fall out of Mr Modi’s visit to China and the praise he got there. And you may not know but we all know that Goa under Digambar Kamat equally contributed to the loot of iron ore to China. But alas he is from Congress and you dare not mention his name.
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纳格先生,你写的文章怎么能没有提及纳伦德拉·穆迪。我认为这是穆迪先生出访中国和在中国获得称赞的附带后果。你可能不知道,但是我们都知道果阿邦在卡马特的领导下同样在向中国出口铁矿石上助纣为孽。哎,他来自国大党,所以你不敢提他的名字。

Desh Premi (Hyderabad) says:
April 26,2012 at 03:16 PM IST
As long as the Mughals were ruling India, neither the British nor the Chinese were able to rob and steal our raw material away. And whatever wealth the Mughals looted, they kept all that within India, not in any Swiss or Mughal Bank outside the country. It is on record that only the Hindu businessmen were the collaborators of the British and now of the Chinese. It is the corrupt Hindu traders, backed by the RSS, who are the real Desh Drohis of Hindustan.
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在莫卧儿统治印度的时候,英国人和中国人都无法偷盗和抢劫我们的原材料。不管莫卧儿抢劫了多少财富,他们将这些财富留在印度,而不是留在瑞士银行或者国外的莫卧儿银行。有记录显示只有印度商人才是以前的英国和现在的中国的合作者。正是全国志愿者组织支持的腐败印度贸易商才是真正的印度斯坦强盗。

(Reply to Desh Premi)- ABC (Hyderabad) says:
April 26,2012 at 05:14 PM IST
British invaded while Mughals were ruling. Nadir Shah invaded while Mughals were ruling and took Peacock Throne and Kohinoor Diamond. China and India lived in peace for centuries together. Their Huang Tsang etc. learned from India and took back Buddhism. Under Muslim rule (especially Turk, Mughal and Afghan Sunni), Hindus were left behind, exploited, raped and 30% were converted.

Thanks to British, Hindus got a chance to bounce back. Thank god 1857 Mutiny was a failure which could bring Muslim rule back. It was unthinkable for Muslims in 1857 to live under Hindu rule. What a difference 90 years could make! By 1947, Hindus were ready to rule themselves and as well as Muslims. But to your point, RSS are Pigs and Desh Drohis. They smear Nehru and worship Jinnah.
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英国在莫卧儿统治的时候入侵印度。 纳迪尔·沙汗在莫卧儿统治的时候入侵并掠夺孔雀宝座和科依诺尔钻石。中国和印度几个世纪以来和平相处。他们的玄奘来印度带回佛教。在msl统治下(特别是突厥人、莫卧儿人和阿富汗逊尼人),印度教徒受到剥削、强奸,30%的印度教徒被迫皈依。

多亏了英国,印度教徒有机会翻身。多亏上帝,1857年可能让msl重新统治的兵变失败了。1857年,msl在印度教徒的规则下生活是不可想象的。1947年以前的90年里带来了很大不同,印度教徒做好了统治自己和msl的准备。不过,同意你的观点,全国志愿者组织(RSS)是猪,他们诽谤尼赫鲁,崇拜真纳

(三泰虎注:科依诺尔钻石是世界最大钻石之一,原重191克拉)

Loyal Congress (Hyderabad) says: [Is India a colony of China? : India : Kingshuk Nag : TOI Blogs]
April 26,2012 at 04:31 PM IST
A country that exports raw material and imports finish goods, is by definition, a colony. Sri Nag’s description if appropriate. If CPM was fan of China, right-wing Swatantra Party rejoiced when China attacked India in 1962. They finally found someone who could bring Mighty Lion Jawaharlal Nehru to his knees! The problem is not Chinese but Indians. It is not China’s fault that they’re progressing. It is our fault that WE are not! Jawaharlal Nehru worked for self-reliance (which China is today) and we smear him as ‘socialist’. We are more interested in toppling Congress governments and smearing Jawaharlal Nehru. If India had Hindu growth under Nehru, China had negative growth under Mao. 36 years after Mao’s death, China turned leaf and became superpower. 48 years after Nehru, India moans, complains and can’t go forward. None after Nehru could carry this nation yet we are so ungrateful and self-destuctive.
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根据定义,出口原材料和进口成品的国家就是殖民地。纳格的描述或许适当。如果印度gcd是中国迷,那么右翼的自由党在中国1962年攻击印度的时候欢呼雀跃。他们最终找到能够让强大狮子贾瓦哈拉尔·尼赫鲁跪倒在地上的人!问题不在于中国人,而在于印度人。中国人进步并不是中国的错,我们没有进步是我们自己的错!贾瓦哈拉尔·尼赫鲁努力自力更生,我们诽谤他是“社会主义者”。我们对推翻国大党政府和诽谤贾瓦哈拉尔·尼赫鲁更感兴趣。如果印度在尼赫鲁统治下出现印度式发展,中国在毛的统治下出现负增长,那么毛走后的36年,中国跨越式进步并成为超级大国;尼赫鲁死后的48年,印度抱怨和无法进步。在尼赫鲁之后,没有人能带邻国家,而我们仍然如此忘恩负义和消极。

(Reply to Loyal Congress)- India (Muscat) says:
April 27,2012 at 02:27 PM IST
Dear Sir, How do you explain Congress rule for major period of Indian Independence. So as per your Statement; Congress is the real culprit in not implementing Nehru’s agenda of Stronger India.
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亲爱的先生,你如何解释印度独立以来大部分时间是国大党在统治。所以按照你的声明,国大党是没有实施尼赫鲁强大印度计划的罪人。

citoyen (world) says:
April 26,2012 at 04:54 PM IST
Your column makes a lot of sense. The fault is squarely ours. India is like Kumbakarna ie fast asleep. We have been sleeping for over 1000 yrs, occasionally rising as in 1947, but only to sleep again. We slept as the Turks invaded us, slept thru the years of Mughal rule, and hardly stirred as a pack of English ruffians stole our country right under our noses. Nehru slept when China occupied the roof of the world, and in one stroke defeated us. We lost the war even before we realised that there was a war to be fought. The debacle of 1962 , only revealed an existing reality. We were sleeping in Kargill and again when Kasab and his boys shut Bombay down. Nothings stirs us. Indian must be the only major country which has not experienced anything like the French/ Russian /American /Chinese revolution. Sleeping people do not revolt, do not clamour for change. We are still sleeping today. God help us!
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你的专栏很有意义。错误在于我们。印度似乎是在沉睡。我们睡了超过1000年,偶尔像1947年那样雄起,但又沉睡下去。我们在突厥人入侵我们的时候沉睡,我们在莫卧儿统治我们的岁月里沉睡。当一群英国恶棍在我们鼻子下偷走我们国家的时候,我们几乎不反抗。尼赫鲁在中国占领世界屋脊和一举击败我们的时候沉睡。甚至在意识到战争发生前,我们就失去了这场战争。1962年的溃败只是揭示了一个已经存在的现实。我们在卡吉尔战争和卡萨布恐怖团伙袭击孟买的时候又一次沉睡。没有什么能让我们振作。印度是唯一这样的大国,即没有经历过法国、俄罗斯、美国和中国所发生的那样革命。沉睡的民族不会反抗,不会吵着改变。我们今天仍然沉睡。上帝帮助我们吧!

Viswanath (Hyderabad) says: [Is India a colony of China? : India : Kingshuk Nag : TOI Blogs]
April 26,2012 at 04:58 PM IST
We should we view history objectively. Sri Nag speaks of China gobbling up Tibet. There are those that turned the argument on Nehru for not invading Tibet to fight-off China. Idiots like Narendra Modi speak of some letter written by stupid Sardar Patel ‘secretly warning’ Nehru of Chinese intentions. What was idiot Sardar Patel’s source? Where was the need to ‘secretly warn’ when Chinese intentions were open proclamations? Tibet was part of Qing (Chiing) rule until 1911. Upon call of Sun Yat-sen all provinces in China, along with Tibet, declared independence. Sun’s idea was to reunite China as a republic (RoC). All the leaders from Sun to Mao never gave up claim on Tibet or any other province. With political turmoil, civil wars and WWII, none of the leaders got time for Tibet which was on outer rims of China.

Finally, Mao, after consolidating his power, moved on Tibet. Fledgling India could never have stopped China. Fighting China could have killed hundreds of thousands of soldiers and millions could have died of starvation. Pakistan could have taken advantage and taken Kashmir while remaining states declare ‘independence’. In 1950, Mao’s PLA pushed mighty McArthur’s WWII winning coalition from Manchuria to 38th parallel suffering half-million deaths and inflicting same. China lost 23 million in WWII, 15 million to different civil wars and 45 million to starvation during ‘great leap’. Indians still cry over 3,000 deaths 50 years ago. Those that don’t have stomach for war should not monger war. We should help Tibetans but we shouldn’t fight China. HINDI-CHINI BHAI BHAI.
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我们应该客观看待历史。纳格提到中国吞并xz。有人争论尼赫鲁没有入侵xz,并和中国人决战。纳伦德拉·穆迪那样的傻子提到了愚蠢的萨达尔·帕特尔写的一些信,信中“秘密警告”尼赫鲁有关中国人的意图。萨达尔·帕特尔傻子哪里来的消息?中国人的意图是公开的,哪里有必要“秘密警告”?在1911年前,xz是清朝的一部分。在孙中山的号召下,包括xz在内的中国各省宣布独立。孙的理想是用共和国来统一中国。从孙到毛的所有中国领导人从来没有放弃对xz或者其他省份的主权声称。在政局动荡、内战和二次世界大战时期,领导人都无暇顾及处在中国外缘的xz。

最终,毛在巩固权力后进入xz。没有经验的印度永远无法阻止中国。和中国打仗可能导致无数士兵的死亡。数以百万的人可能饿死。巴基斯坦可能趁机夺取克什米尔。其余各邦可能宣布独立。1950年,毛的军队将麦克阿瑟强大的二战胜利联军从满洲里推到三八线。中国在二战死亡2300万人、内战死亡1500万人,“大跃进”时期死亡4500万人。印度人仍然为50年前死亡3000人而哭叫。那些没有战争胃口的人不应该制造战争。我们应该帮助xz人,但是不应该和中国打仗。中印亲如兄弟!

(Reply to Viswanath)- ravi (blore) says:

April 27,2012 at 01:56 AM IST
u r a chinese agent or pak terrorist.
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你是中国代理人或者巴基斯坦恐怖分子。

chinmay (hyderabad) says:
April 26,2012 at 05:43 PM IST
Kingshuk Nag your evil congress is more dangerous than china
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纳格,你们邪恶的国大党比中国更有威胁性。

Ajay (US) says:
April 26,2012 at 06:27 PM IST
India does not have the guts to stand upto Pakistan. How do you expect it to stand upto the ultimate bully-China. The only time our foreign ministry does something is when some politician or filmstar is interrogated/frisked at an airport.
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印度没有勇气面对巴基斯坦。你又如何能期望印度能勇敢面对中国恶霸。我们外交部唯一能办些事情的时候是某些政客或者电影明星在机场被审问和被搜身的时候。

原创翻译:三泰虎 http://www.santaihu.com

(London) says:
April 26,2012 at 07:32 PM IST
Surprisingly… an article from this Nag without mentioning the name of Modi!!!!
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令人吃惊地是…纳格写的这篇文章没有提到穆迪的名字!!!

sam the man from pakistan (canada) says:
April 26,2012 at 08:33 PM IST
YES Nag,You are 100% right,india will be very soon colony of china and pakistan,india will be devided into 50 diffrent states and slave by china and pakistan………….and this is the reality…… GAY HIND
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是的,纳格,你说得100%正确。印度将很快成为中国和巴基斯坦的殖民地。印度将分裂成50个不同的国家,被中国和巴基斯坦奴役…这是现实…

(未完待续)

友荐云推荐
  1. 真是没有敌人就给自己找个敌人~虽然印度在62年的时候战败了~但是得到了实际的利益那就是藏南那么大的一片土地。有几个战胜国是战胜后丢掉土地的?中国北边有俄国东边有韩国,日本和美国,南边还有一些不省心的东南亚国家,和他们比印度是最没有利害关系的国家。西藏有又不是什么经济发达地区。只要印度不搞藏独,我想北京才不会闲着没事搞印度,能的得到什么?

    • 亲爱的,所谓丢掉藏南虽然经不起推敲,但是这个所谓胜利后丧失领土或更多的领土的传统可是很悠久的……最近的就是国民和北洋了

  2. 4500W的那个数据貌似有很多版本呢。。。那个时候尚没实行计划生育,民政部门的统计结果只有几百万非正常死亡的样子,但是目前流传有1000W,2100W,3000W,5000W,6000W等多个版本。令人眼花燎绕,匪夷所思啊。。。

      • 你真洞若观火呀。之所以提未实行计划生育,是想说那个时候不存在黑户口,同时干部工作认真,群众登记踊跃,人口普查一次是多少人就是多少人。令人无语的是连《党史》也为压众口,加重耄的“罪孽”而选用了1000w这个数。不过也可能是我诛心之论了。在全国混乱的情况下,人口无序流动太大,统计死亡人数可能存在偏差,所以TG采用加权算法未尝不可。

  3. Mekong, happens to be the lifeline of Indo China
    这里的INDOCHINA就是印度支那,指的就是东南亚的中南半岛地区,原文是无误的。老虎理解错了。

    全文透露出印度觊觎西藏的野心,不惜以谎言洗地。印度独立后的野心一直很大,吞并锡金(SIKKIM,原是喜马拉雅山区的小国,同中国西藏,印度,尼泊尔,不丹接壤),直接控制尼泊尔王室(直到发生王室弑父惨案,后被尼共推翻君主统治),意图以民族联系(泰米尔人)吞并斯里兰卡。西藏只是印度的目标之一,印度的野心是所有受印度文化影响的地区。印度洋周围的岛国,印度人占人口往往超过50%,甚至非洲靠近印度洋岛国如塞舌尔等也是如此,如果印度真的强大,印度洋就是印度的内海。

  4. 印度人把这种经济交流也叫”入侵”,还”殖民”.如果继续这种想法,印度的发展依然是有限的。作为工业落后的国家,你必须在这种经济交流中促进经济发展,达到积累,然后看到这种短处,并努力提高工业制造水平,改变经济增长模式,提高高附加值产品的出口。而不是禁止原材料的出口。等印度的制造水平提高了,它就可以自己用原材料进行加工并出口。
    另:博主,每次等你更新好辛苦啊,都要点击10来次,才发现你有更新。
    博主辛苦!

  5. 我觉得也是,其他地方都够乱的了,和印度还是要缓和一些好,不然真的要十面埋伏、四面楚歌了

  6. 大跃进的时候是死了很多人的,主要死的是中原地带的人,我是湖南人,我听我奶奶说起过当时的情况,,当时饿死的人大多数都是老人,和小孩,根据我了解的情况死的是农村人比较多,城市人好像没有怎么死人,北方死的比南方也要多,具体是多少就不是很清楚了根据我了解的情况估计不会超过1000万,我奶奶现在90多岁,

  7. 我也是湖南人…但是1000W………那时候一家最少有4个5个6个7个..我爸爸那一代人就是7个 ….1家饿死一个相当于中国有4000W-5000W个家庭饿死一个人…真饿死1000W那不知道那时候中国有几个家庭没饿死人了?…印度现在的人均粮食也才是三年灾难的水平 不过他们在热带 没这么容易死而已

    • 恩,印度说我们死了4000多万那就太夸张了毕竟当时很多老人是正常死亡的还有就是当时医疗水平差,也会有些人是生病而死,因为当时虽然但吃不饱但还是有粮食吃的,我们家没有饿死人的情况,但亲戚家有,主要是亲戚家人口比较多,分到的粮食就少了点。这是湖南的基本情况,因为发生灾难主要的地方是北方,所以北方的情况就不知道了,如果有北方的人话介绍一下情况,好让我们有个具体的估算,我也想知道中国当时到底死了多少人

  8. 我在一家中国公司工作。有超过500名中国人在这里工作(比在这里工作的印度人多,是一个火电项目)。在我工作的2年期间,我看到他们是如何(在印度人的帮助下)玩弄印度法律。从当地警察局局长到政客,大家都为了钱而帮助他们。
    —————————————————-
    为什么不说是印度法律玩弄了外国公司,在印度如果不贿赂别说发展,连生存都不可能 印度人说话不带脑子

  9. 虚胖的阿三跟中国相比根本就不是一个能量级的,西方吹捧出的“金砖”其本质是块灰砖。 🙄

  10. 中国现在的处境和印度差不多啊,中国的什么东西买的很便宜,像什么稀土,却他妹妹的天价进口铁矿石和石油,中国人的是怎么了额?

    • 做稀土生意的是当官的小姨子,小舅子,二奶和他的姐夫,反正不是没来头滴,反正不是国家在打不留提饿里,必须承担的份额.粘不上的人己经贴上仇富的标签.
      房产商不象话——-“你有仇富心理”
      垄断行业高工资——-“你有仇富心理”
      卡片机和单反一样——–“你有仇富心理”
      印度就是中国的镜子,三哥的不平等和我们一样,没什么不同.
      不久前,卑人见一教授说,中国人还不适应新体制,卑人听得云山雾罩

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  17. 印度最大的症结应该就如一位印网友说的变革者,逆来顺受惯了忘记了挣扎,有点像鲁迅那个的时代。可惜他们没有醒过来的人。