从这里了解印度人对中国的看法

巴基斯坦军网有关歼21/歼31战机的讨论

2012-09-19 23:21 58个评论 字号:

歼-31是沈阳飞机工业集团研制的第四代双发中型隐形战斗机,其采用双发、单座、固定斜垂尾、无鸭翼、DSI进气道(猜测)。其主要作用是与歼-20形成高低配,或用于出口。2012年9月16日,歼-31正式亮相军网。据说此战机将命名为鹘鹰, 歼-31(代号31001的一号机)。粽子机——歼31,中国第二款隐形战机亮相!这是继2011年初成飞歼20重型隐形战机震撼上网以后,沈飞为中国贡献的保钓利器。歼-31隐形战机也在巴基斯坦防卫论坛亮相,印度网民和巴基斯坦网民发表了各自看法。

原帖标题:shenyang j-31
原帖链接:http://www.defence.pk/forums/chinese-defence/207796-shenyang-j-31-news-discussions.html

j21、j31

以下是印巴网民的评论:

A.Rafay(巴基斯坦)
Thats COOL, Is this have similarities with j20, Looks like it!

很酷,这架和歼20类似吗,看起来像!

Tshering22(印度)
Oh another one?

Guess there are rival design bureaus competing with each other to get the government contract. It is impressive how Chinese have emulated the US style of getting bureaus (in US, companies) to compete against each other for government contracts.

Judging by this, I am thinking that it is going to be a J-20 vs J-31 showdown before PLAAF finally selects its 5th gen jet just like Boeing X-32 vs LM’s X-35.

哦,另一种飞机?

我猜有几个设计局彼此在竞争获得政府合同。令人印象深刻的是,中国人模仿美国让设计局(或公司)通过竞标获得政府合同的模式。

据此判断,我认为,解放军空军在最终选择五代机前,J-20和J-31之间将会出现一场较量,类似波音的X-32和洛克希德.马丁的X-35之间的竞争。

原创翻译:三泰虎 http://www.santaihu.com

Hyperion(巴基斯坦)
Who cares if it’s a copy or not. Does it fire ‘lolly pop’ missiles, are bullets made up of sugar, do the bombs explode with rose petals?

谁会在意是否是山寨货。它发射的是棒棒糖导弹吗,子弹是糖做的吗,zha弹暴炸时会绽放玫瑰花瓣?

TeriShirtDaButton(印度)
New weapon in the sinochallenger arsenal

now Megaton J-31

中国武器库新添一件挑战性武器。

“百万吨级”的J-31

BlueDot_in_Space(印度)
Simple, all of them are 5th gen in look only, not in capability. US is still struggling with F35, even after making F22 and here we have china coming up with a 5th gen plane on a daily basis, LOL!

简单,全部都是五代机外观,并不具备五代机的能力。在制造了F22后,美国的F35仍然步履维艰。我们却看到中国天天推出五代机,笑!

karan21(印度)
Changing the looks of the plane itself is very complicated task, its not as easy as you say. These planes even fitted with 4.5 avionics and long range bvr and aesa radars will make a deadly machine.

改变飞机外观本身是一项复杂任务,并非如你所想那么简单。这些飞机装载有4.5代航天电子设备和AESA雷达,具备远程超视距能力,组成了致命的机器。

BlueDot_in_Space(印度)
How do you know this plane is for real?? let it fly first in an international show, then only one can assess its real capability.

你怎么知道这架飞机是真的?先让它首先在国际航展上表演,然后才能评估其真实能力。

Hyperion(巴基斯坦)
Maybe true, maybe not, however, I would give Chinese the benefit of doubt as they have pulled-off such things before!

可能是真的,可能不是。中国人以前撤消过类似项目,所以值得怀疑!

BlueDot_in_Space(印度)
Pulled off what?? J20?? it is still a prototype, can turn out to be a tech demonstrator. Nothing is known of its capability apart from its 5th gen tag, only speculations.

撤销过什么?J20?仍然是原型机,可能是技术展示样机。除了“贴有”五代机标签外,相关能力并未为人所知,只是猜测而已。

Irfan Baloch(印度)
the real question is

will it be able to fly? a Chinese or Russian engine?

will it have all its components that are immune to sanctions?
not playing down the effort but the real stuff lies beneath the surface and thats a big question mark.

真正的问题是:它会飞吗?发动机是中国制还是俄罗斯制?

所有零件均不会遭受制裁的风险?

并非要泼冷水,但真正的问题隐藏在表面之下,这是一个大问题。

Imran Khan(巴基斯坦)
china you confusing us damn which one we buy now so many choices

中国,你让我们困惑,我们该买哪一架呢,现在太多选择啦。

Zabaniya(孟加拉国)
It makes shopping more fun!

购物变得更有趣!

Hyperion(巴基斯坦)
Sometimes confuses the **** out of you! It’s like making a choice between two beautiful women

有时候会让你大为困惑!就像要在两个美女之间做出选择那样难。

Esc8781(牙买加)
Developing two stealth fighters at the same time is going to be difficult though wish you all the luck plus there is one of them is longed range and one of them is on the carriers so both of them can be implemented in the South China sea. So the J-20 was in a ATF competition already nice.

同时开发两种隐形战机是困难的,不过预祝好运。此外,其中一种是远程飞机,另一种是舰载机,两种飞机在南海都能派上用场。J-20飞机已经处于先进战术战机的竞争之中,不错。

damiendehorn(孟加拉国)
OMG the Chinese are at it again with their copy n paste

哦,天啊,中国人又在玩“复制粘贴”游戏了。

Esc8781(牙买加)
At least copying and pasting is good enough to defend one’s country and interests.

至少“复制粘贴”足以保卫国家和利益。

qwerrty(马来西亚)
looks like j-20 without canards

看起来像是没有鸭翼的J20

SHAMK9(巴基斯坦)
I hope PAF orders a few of these

我希望巴基斯坦空军能下订单买一些。

Najam Khan(巴基斯坦)
Its not just hardware that needs to be state-of-the-art, Avionics,weapon suite and testing are equally important.

Congratulations to China, there is still a long way to go. But as they say:”A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step”

不仅仅是硬件要达到最高水准,航空电子设备、武器配套和测试同样重要。

祝贺中国,不过还有很长一段路要走。正如他们所说的:“千里之行始于跬步”。

OrionHunter(印度)
J-31? Another ‘J’!! How many ‘J’s are you guys gonna produce? J-5 to J-21 so far and now J-31. At the rate with which the Chinese are going, there would probably be J-32 to J-100 before this year is out!!

I wonder whether there would be any real radical changes in concept and design or just different paint jobs on the same platform??

J-31?又一架“歼”系列飞机!!你们这些家伙要生产多少种“歼”系列飞机?从歼5到歼21,现在是歼31。按照这种速度,中国人今年内可能会从歼32一直推出至歼100!

我想知道概念和设计上是否会有大刀阔步的改变,还是说只是同一平台上刷不同的漆而已?

原创翻译:三泰虎 http://www.santaihu.com

karan21(印度)
One thing I like about China the most is that if it says something, it phucking delivers it on time and shocks the world. In India though small things take decades to fix and make them happen. 1 failure puts India 5 years behind, while China bounces back after a failure like a rockstar. Man I have to say, this nation can do the impossible. It can become the world’s strongest nation ever.

中国让我最喜欢的一个方面是:说到做到,按时完成,然后震惊世界。在印度,小小事情需要几十年来解决,一个失败会让印度拖延5年,而中国失败后会像火箭一样反冲。朋友,我不得不要说的是,这个国家能成人所不能成,会成为世界上最强大的国家。

karan21(印度)
it doesn’t matter who did it first since this is not a race, India might achieve what China achieved 10 yrs later. Usa did moon landing in 1969, so that doesn’t mean the china or esa or isro won’t do it in 20xx. It’s about vision, thankfully both India and China have a vision to develop and compete with west and leave them behind on day.

For example, China got it’s GPS in early 2000s, India is now ready to deploy one of its own within 1 year. Development is an ongoing process and Chinese economy is bigger. China became 2 trillion in 2004, While India this year will complete 2 trillion, so we are 8 years behind economically. As long as India keeps moving forward I an happy.

这并非是一场竞赛,谁先做到并不重要。印度或许会晚于中国十年完成。美国在1969年就登月了,并不意味着中国、欧洲航天局或者印度空间研究组织在20xx年不会登月。关键是愿景,多亏印度和中国有与西方竞争并将其抛在后面的愿景。

比如,中国21世纪前几年就有了自己的GPS,印度准备在一年内部署一枚自己的定位卫星。发展是一个过程,中国经济规模更大,在2004年达到2万亿美元规模,印度今年也会达到2万亿美元,所以我们经济上落后中国8年。只要印度保持前进,我就会高兴。

Oldman1(美国)
Still surprise they used a bird on there instead of a red star.

意外的是他们在飞机上用了小鸟的标志,而不是一颗红色五角星。

Oscar
This is interesting..
If that is the actual aircraft.. and the Chinese have decided to take their stolen F-35 data and literally create an adapted clone.. its an achievement in itself.
Because it signifies two very important things..
First.. that the chinese air industry is growing by leaps and bounds through whatever pathway it has chosen.. reverse engineering or not.. its allowing it to keep abreast of the worlds best in terms of aerodynamic design.

Second.. That contrary to claims by Lockheed.. there was a lot taken away from the F-35 program that is not being disclosed.
At least enough to provide exacting blueprints for the frontal section of this aircraft whose rear resembles the F-22.

So if this is called the J-31.. then the J-31 is the mashup of the F-22 and F-35..
Thats not just a copy paste.. thats the best of both worlds.

And since this is a private venture, it means.. that Chinas allies have something to smile about.

There is still a lot of work to be done in the engine bays it seems.. fairly crude.

有趣…

如果是真机,那么中国人已经决定基于偷来的F35战机数据克隆改造一架出来,本身就是一项成就。

因为它意味着两个重要方面:

首先,不管选择了逆向工程还是何种方式,中国航空工业出现了跳跃式进步,能够让其在气动设计上与世界最高水平并驾齐驱。

其次,这与洛克希德公司的声明相悖,这架飞机采用了许多F35项目还没有披露的设计,至少足以显示飞机前部的设计蓝图,尾部则类似F22

所以如果被称为J31,那么J31就是F22和F35的混搭,并不只是“复制粘贴”。

由于是私营企业设计,意味着中国盟友有了一些值得会心一笑的东西。

发动机舱还有许多有待改进的地方,看起来相当粗糙。

trendmaker1(印度)
it’s j20 with modifications…
it’s not a new one as china doesn’t need another one..!!!
They should concentrate on j 20 to make it better…

是J20的修改版…

不是新的飞机,因为中国不需要!

他们应该集中改良J20…

peaceful(香港)
it is a new one designed by a completely different company

这是另一家公司的新设计。

Oldman1(美国)
Competition is good hence why Lockheed Martin and Boeing be fighting each other for such a project.

有竞争才好,所以会有洛克希德·马丁公司和波音公司为了获得项目而相互竞争。

farhan_9909(巴基斯坦)
paf for the sake of GOD
leave the j10b

rather wait for a few more years and take this baby

巴基斯坦空军,看在上帝的份上,请放弃歼10b

宁愿为这个宝贝再等几年。

原创翻译:三泰虎 http://www.santaihu.com

J20

...

Windjammer(巴基斯坦)
Man, that line up already looks very impressive, with the new kid on the block, Pakistan is really spoilt for choice now.

哥们,这一排飞机已经看起来令人印象非常深刻,随着这个新的“孩子”加入阵营中,那巴基斯坦就真的眼花缭乱,选择太多啦!

yesboss(巴基斯坦)
I was really expecting an exportable version of stealth generation fighter from china , smaller as compared to J20 & equiped with ws-13 engines. Does this new aircraft has ws-13 or what size of an engine . This would be really great for pakistan , the speed at which china is working on stealth fighter jets or even other military hardwares is unbelievable and enjoyable at same time . If this new baby is for real …… then does it mean that pakistan would skip over with J-10’s ?

我真的很期待中国隐形战机的出口版本,比歼20更小,配备ws-13涡扇发动机。这架新飞机是配备ws-13涡扇发动机还是什么型号的发动机。非常适合巴基斯坦。中国研发隐形战机或者其他军事硬件的速度令人难以置信,同时又令人愉快。如果这个新“宝贝”是真的,是否意味着巴基斯坦可以跳过歼10直接要这个“宝贝”?

nuclearpak(巴基斯坦)
This is going to get awfully interesting.

Looks very familiar to J-20. Some major differences I can see are:

No canards.
Nose landing gear.
And a bit on the rear end.

What is that insignia on the tail? Some squadron or centre?

BTW, anybody remember that airframe that was being transported on a truck some time back?

可能会相当有趣。

看起来非常像歼20,我发现有一些主要不同:

没有鸭翼

前起落架

尾部有点不同

尾部的徽章是什么?

顺便说下,还有人记得前段时间卡车拉的机身吗?

mylovepakistan(巴基斯坦)
chinese are astonishing the world….

中国人让世界吃惊…

HellzHere(印度)
If it is really something credible,then why isn’t it coming out anywhere?
Weird colors,insignia.
Looks more like a photoshop work,no one is even talking bout it except here and some Chinese forums.
Let there be an official word or confirmation or a hint of it,before everyone starts speculating and jumping?

如果真的可信,为什么没有到处报道?

奇怪的颜色和徽章。

看起来更像是PS的。除了这里和一些中国论坛,压根就没人讨论。

在开始猜测和欢呼雀跃前,先等官方确认或者暗示吧。

UKBengali(孟加拉国)
This is exactly the type of fighter that may be offered to countries like BD for purchase in the next decade.

While it may not be up to the level of the F-22, it will wipe-out the likes of Su-30, Eurofighter and Rafales from of the skies.

It is a deliberate Chinese policy to make 3rd world countries less dependent on the West and Russia for advanced military equipment.

The Chinese are so damn clever!!!

这可能恰恰是中国未来十年供出口给孟加拉国等国家的战机。

或许没有达到F22的水平,但是会把苏30、欧洲战斗机和阵风战机逐出空中。

这是中国人的政策,即故意让第三世界国家减少依赖西方和俄罗斯的先进军事装备。

中国人太聪明了!

Stealth(巴基斯坦)
Seriously thats what i call “INDEPENDENT Military hardware manufacturer” not like India buying each and everything from USA/Russia/France/Israel!

严肃地说,这就是我所说的“独立军事硬件生产国”。印度则不一样,一切都购自美国、俄罗斯、法国和以色列!

wakapdf(巴基斯坦)
congratulations … who cares if its innovation or copied, majority of US war machinery is copied of German ww2 tech

祝贺…谁会在意是创新还是山寨,美国大多数战争机器抄袭自德国二战技术。

友荐云推荐
  1. 看来孟加拉国准备和巴基斯坦一同对付三锅们的嘴炮啦,还有就是,好长时间没有看到库马尔了。

    • 也没那么久,就改革开放以后8几年的时候,那时候上学要2,3块钱,都有的孩纸上不起,彩色糖1分钱2个。记得么?不记得问问上了年纪的人,他们肯定有记忆。

    • 他的意思是说,中国14亿人全部停止生产活动,等着阿三死搞八年,他们才能赶得上。。。
      可是,中国经济发展的速度要远高于阿三。。要是按照这个理论算,阿三可能永远也赶不上中国了。。。

  2. 三泰虎高产啊!平均一天刷新一次,辛苦啦!想观赏印度虎,现在又来了孟加拉虎,都是以随地大小便来宣示领地滴,三哥森林之王啊!

  3. 三哥看不起中国,但说这话的时候从来不考虑自己。问题是三哥自己的飞机哪?设计的3代机还没正式列装,俺们这里的J10起步稍慢,也已经成军了。我估计J20会和三哥的三代机一起服役,他们办事太拖拉。眼高手低的厉害。

  4. 2010年中国GDP 5.745万亿美元,同年印度 1.430万亿
    2011年中国GDP 7.298万亿美元,同年印度 1.676万亿
    一般统计是按国内货币计算,中国8%,印度7%。
    但按实际折算以后,中国增长27%,印度增长17%,这其中包括了汇率因素。如果按绝对数值算,中国1年增加了一个印度的GDP总量。
    我觉得单从这点上讲,阿三的8年差距论就很可笑了。按比例,按绝对数,这之间的差距只会越来越大。

    • 不错!
      2011年中国GDP7426090百万美元,同年印度 1430020百万美元。
      按同为8%的增长率,
      印度要达到中国2011年的水平需23年。
      23年后中国GDP为49090178百万美元(林毅夫预测),是美国的2倍,是阿三的6.6倍!
      差距会越来越大,阿三也太乐观了…

  5. 按照毛泽东把中国大陆从一盘散沙整合成铁板一块的1949年10月算的话,印度跟我们的差距其实快80年了。这其中,还我们犯了好多错误,三哥也犯了好多错误。其实吧在国与国之间的竞争,我发现,就是自己尽量少犯错误,而想尽办法去坑对手,让这个时间差越拉越大,最好能拉出一代的距离,就像大英帝国对晚晴一样,你就赢了。

  6. 我们废除奴隶制是在公元前5世纪左右,现在三哥家的农村还处在大地主时代,奴隶见了主人要亲脚,还要用手给主人擦屁股,所以印度落后我们2500年

  7. 又见阿三精神.呵呵,谢谢博主,我再顶.
    1、阿三“PS”论。每每有中国新的东西出来,阿三总是先自我安慰,然后贬低中国。PS的。呵呵,J-20刚出来的时候,阿三PS论是满天飞,最后事实让这些人闭嘴了。
    2、阿三“山寨”论。“山寨”这个词出来后,对于阿三的精英来说,算是有了攻击和贬低中国的“强大武器”,一个“山寨”,抹杀了中国的所有进步和领先——当然,这只是对阿三精神来说的。你阿三不知道很多东西发展的步伐,是学习、模仿、进步、创新的吗?所谓连走都不会就要跑,那就是你阿三。更何况,你阿三有本事也山寨出个东西来啊。“啊琼”其实就是个拼装的“山寨”货,可惜,自己没有一点工业底子,拼装的时间长的不行,钱一再的花,搞出来的东西,是垃圾。
    3、阿三“垃圾”论。一旦词穷,没有什么理由了,阿三就抛出“中国制造垃圾”论。好吧,你啊三“自慰”能力强,先别说别人的是“垃圾”,这个垃圾你有能力做的出来吗?
    4、阿三“偷窃”论。当中国的先进东西摆在那里,阿三那么多的“歪论”都说不过去的时候,就叫嚣到“中国骗子”“中国小偷”。当你们阿三努力把美国抬的那么高的时候,当你们阿三以可以买到美国武器而骄傲的时候,当你们以中美关系对抗而欢呼的时候。你怎么就没想到:既然美国那么厉害,怎么中国的情报和间谍工作可以比美国更先进?既然美国和你们关系那么好,你怎么也不弄个一知半解的?如果这个美国的最高机密都那么好偷,那美国是不是太失败了、太落后了?
    如果,那么先进的东西,这么好偷,这么好山寨,估计,世界F-22已经漫天飞了啊。啊三,别再无知啊。

  8. 个人认为这是中国航母的舰载机,看它公布的时间点与场合政治氛围来看,有80%的可能性,所以巴如果是想要陆上机的话,还是暂时不要考虑此机型了

  9. One thing I like about China the most is that if it says something, it phucking delivers it on time and shocks the world. In India though small things take decades to fix and make them happen. 1 failure puts India 5 years behind, while China bounces back after a failure like a rockstar. Man I have to say, this nation can do the impossible. It can become the world’s strongest nation ever.

    中国让我最喜欢的一个方面是:说到做到,按时完成,然后震惊世界。在印度,小小事情需要几十年来解决,一个失败会让印度拖延5年,而中国失败后会像火箭一样反冲。朋友,我不得不要说的是,这个国家能成人所不能成,会成为世界上最强大的国家。