三泰虎

为什么印度空军不怕中国歼20,印网友:本来就不是用来吓唬印度空军的

Why is the Indian Air Force not afraid of a Chinese stealth fighter aircraft J-20?

为什么印度空军不怕中国的隐形战机J-20? (2)

 Quora读者的评论:

Shekhar Attri, studies at Reva Institute of Technology and Management Bangalore (2021)

Answered Dec 4, 2016

See, J-20 is just a copy of American F-22.

Look.

看到没,J-20只是在模仿美国的F-22。

瞧瞧。

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China has always reverse engineered the outside technologies.

Now coming to the point, that why India is not afraid of this aircraft, I will put some points here.

1 Why would any country will put any order of other foreign aircraft, if it has its own advanced aircraft??? Yes, the chinese has put an order of Russian Su-35. Because they know that they are unable to meet there specifications in J-20.

Well they claim to detect stealth aircraft, but there radars are not very good. Hence they plan to buy 4 Russians Su 35.

2 Well this aircraft is in its low rate initial production. Till they will introduced it in PLAAF the Russian Indian FGFA will also be ready for its induction in IAF (maximum 6 months later after J 20).

Now you think, if China are so eager for Su- 35, how advanced will FGFA be, which both Russia and India will not share with anyone.

中国一直在对国外技术进行逆向工程。

现在来说说重点,为什么印度不怕这架飞机,我在这里会从几个方面进行说明。

1.如果一个国家拥有自己的先进飞机,为什么还要订购别国的飞机??是的,中国已经签订了俄罗斯苏-35的采购订单。因为他们知道他们J-20的性能达不到既定要求。

没错,他们声称能探测到隐形飞机,但是他们的雷达并不出色。因此他们计划购买4架俄罗斯苏35。

2.嗯,这架飞机一开始的生产速度很低。等这架飞机进入中国人民解放军空军服役的时候,俄罗斯印度的第五代战斗机也差不多可以进入印度空军服役了(最迟比J-20晚6个月)。

现在你想想,如果中国如此渴望苏- 35战机,那么第五代战斗机会有多先进,俄罗斯和印度是不会与别人分享的。

3 Now if you are thinking they will pass this technology to Pakistan, then forget about this. Firstly it is strictly not for export (same as F-22, no one will share there latest technology). Now coming to pakistan, can they afford to buy it!!! Year before they do not go ahead to buy F-16 for $700 million.

And do you actually think China consider pakistan as its ally?? They are just using it for there purpose, and there increasing economy.

4 India is in very few countries that have nuclear triad ie they can attack from land, sea and air. And moreover India’s Missile defence system is ranked among top nations (for ex: as most of the answer here mention S-400 Triumph).

5 India always have support of Russia. And now at this time, most country have dispute with China. Vietnam, Japan, US and NATO countries clearly do not like him and will engage in war if they dare to atrack India.

So China will never think to attack India, after looking to our military power. There increasing economy cannt afford any war.

India has never invaded any country first, but if some one will try, we wont tolerate it. And China must know it, that we are always ready for there freindhip proposal.

3.如果你认为他们会把这项技术传授给巴基斯坦,想都别想了。首先,这是严禁出口的(和F-22一样,没有人愿意分享自己的最新技术)。再说到巴基斯坦,他们能买得起吗!!一年前,他们都负担不起7亿美元的F-16采购计划。

你真的认为中国把巴基斯坦当盟友了?他们只是为了自己的目的和经济而利用它。

4.印度是极少数拥有战略核三角的国家(即可以从陆地、海上和空中发动进攻的国家)。此外,印度的导弹防御系统也名列前茅(如:大多数回答都提到了S-400“凯旋”防空导弹系统)。

5.印度一直得到俄罗斯的支持。而现在这个时候,大多数国家都与中国存在争端。越南、日本、美国和北约国家显然不喜欢中国,如果中国胆敢攻击印度,这些国家会参战。

所以在衡量过我们的军事实力后,中国永远不会考虑攻击印度。他们不断增长的经济负担不起任何一场战争。

印度从来不曾主动侵略过任何国家,但是如果有人试图侵犯,我们绝不会容忍。中国必须知道,我们随时愿意接受他们抛出的橄榄枝。

 

Abbey Laurel-Smith, Works at at ReBuildUSAtoday-HPAC

Updated Jul 12, 2018

Fact is India is not afraid because of the way Chinese stealth fighters - like all stealth fighters and other air crafts, are configured.

One thing U.S. and European fighter craft manufacturers have never considered is the fact that there is a natural barrier between India and China. This barrier is more to India’s advantage.

It has been for centuries, and has always helped them against invaders from the north. Alexander in the north west and Genghis Khan in the north, north east, east failed in their attempt to conquer India in this vast area.

And small India of today (small because India have shrunk in size) with fixed Russian technology alone, have mastered how best to use this natural barrier as a kind of early warning for all kinds of landings and take offs in China and the rest of the Caucasus.

To overcome this barrier, the shape of a stealth aircraft or any aircraft for that matter have to be modified to deal with:

事实上,印度并不担心中国隐形战机的配置——就像所有隐形战机和其他飞行器一样。

美国和欧洲战斗机制造商从未考虑过的一个事实是,印度和中国之间存在着一个天然屏障。这一屏障对印度更为有利。

几个世纪以来,这个屏障一直帮助印度抵御来自北方的侵略者。西北部的亚历山大,北部、东北部、东部的成吉思汗,他们征服印度的企图都因为这片广袤的地区而折戟。

今天的小印度(小是因为印度的国土面积缩水了)加上俄罗斯的技术,已经十分清楚怎么最好地利用这个自然屏障,作为在中国和高加索地区飞机起降的早期预警。

为了克服这一障碍,隐形飞机或任何相关飞机的形状都必须进行调整,才能应付:

thin air flight endurance

extremely high altitude performance and ability to cruise

a way to reduce intake that might be almost non existence, and cold if there is any

a way to reduce exhaust and after burner trail by mixing exhaust gas trail with cool air before releasing it into the atmosphere

a way to reduce engine and equipment malfunction at that altitude

a way to make the aircraft lightening proof

What China have now and plan to build for the next ten years is conducive for conventional op. in other areas except for robust and tactical engagement in and around the Himalayas or it’s long border with India.

India will be a little worried if China starts to build bombers and recce aircrafts like the B2 bomber and the SR-71. But then those are fast movers, not loitering birds.

Another country with this type of high altitude, thin air and early warning advantage is North Korea.

稀薄的空气下持续飞行

极高的高空性能和巡航能力

可能几乎不存在的减少进气的方法

在排放到大气中前将废气尾迹与冷空气混合,以减少废气排放和后燃器尾迹的方法

降低高空中引擎和设备故障发生率的方法

让飞机防雷击的方法

中国目前及计划在未来十年内建成的项目有利于其在喜马拉雅山脉及周边地区或与印度的长边界地区进行活跃的战术作之外的常规军事活动。

如果中国开始建造像B2轰炸机和SR-71这样的轰炸机和侦察机,印度就真的有点担心了。但这些飞机的移动速度很快,不会在天上盘旋。

另一个拥有这种高海拔、稀薄空气和预警优势的国家是朝鲜。

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We should be more concerned once Russia start building this type of fish with “through body” air intake and “cool” exhaust dissipation on the wings, tail fins and the back.

俄罗斯开始建造这种鱼型飞机的时候,我们应该更加关注,这种飞机的进气会穿透“机身”,通过机翼、尾翼和背翼冷却尾气并排出。

 

Arnab Chatterjee, glad to be born Indian

Answered Jul 19, 2018

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The short answer is that neither India nor china is stupid enough to try and make each other afraid!

WHY? …..

because we both are established nuclear powers with intercontinental capabilities and none of us have a credible ballistic missile defence which any way is never 100% effective in any case!

the main answer is that the stealth fighters are the epitome of any countries power projection around the world. it can be compared to an aerial equivalent to nuclear submarines. thus it takes heavy investment as these beasts are designed to last at-least 4–5 decades with successive modernization along the way. precisely due to this reason, these weapons are mainly for first strike missions and penetration attacks! these bests are simply too costly to be put into active combat theaters and dogfight scenarios. simply put , it will be a huge waste of money if an advanced Akaash SAM or S400 Triumph, shoots down a J-20. moreover the nations like India which though lagging still having considerable heft in the high-tech industries of the world, can also build better stealth detecting radars as well as advanced air defence on its own , thereby raising the costs to benefit of ever using these expensive jets into active war scenarios!

简而言之,印度和中国都没有愚蠢到试图恐和对方!

为什么呢?.....

因为我们都是拥有洲际能力的核大国,而且我们都没有足够可靠的弹道导弹防御系统,达到100%的成功率!

最主要的答案是,隐形战机是世界上任何一个国家军事实力的象征。它是可以用来和核潜艇媲美的空中对手。因此需要大量的投资,因为这些武器的设计寿命至少为40 - 50年,还可以不断地更新。正是由于这个原因,这些武器主要会被用于第一轮打击任务和渗透攻击!这些武器造价太过昂贵,无法用于实战和空战。简单地说,如果J-20被先进的Akaash SAM或S400“凯旋”防空导弹系统击落,那将是巨大的经济浪费。此外,像印度这样的国家虽然落于人后,但在世界高科技产业中仍有相当大的影响力,印度也可以自己打造更好的隐身探测雷达和先进的防空系统,从而提高将这些昂贵的喷气机投入实战的成本效益!

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Secondly , every fighter , no matter how good is a combination of trade-off. for example, a Mig31 is not that stealthy, but it is still the fastest fighter that could even out run the incoming missiles and hostile fighter,could also fly highest till the invention of artificial communications satellites! similarly, we all know that despite being very high-tech, F35 are quite vulnerable to basic ammunition , thus rendering it useless as a robust workhorse which the Mig21 served numerous air forces around the world. in high intensity network centric warfare, one needs disposable assets and minimum human casualties. stealth is not a very reliable factor in combat. if the fighter cant fight on its own, it is only a liability. a lesson that Americans learnt the hard way against Russians in Vietnam. so much so that they had to smuggle in a Mig21 from Egypt, to learn to how to defeat it with Israeli help.

其次,每一种战斗机,无论多出色,都是经过权衡取舍后各种性能的组合。例如,米格31的隐形性不够好,但它仍然是速度最快的战斗机,甚至可以跑赢来袭的导弹和敌方战斗机,还能飞到人造通信卫星的高度!同样,我们都知道,尽管F35技术含量很高,但它很容易受到枪炮的攻击,因此,把它作为主力机型毫无用处,米格21则能为世界多国的空军服务。在以网络为中心的高强度战争中,一个国家需要可支配资产和最少的人员伤亡。隐形战斗机在战争中并不是一个非常可靠的因素。如果战斗机本身不能参与作战,那就是一种负担。这是美国人在越南跟俄罗斯人苦战后得到的一个教训。以至于他们后来不得不从埃及走私一架米格21战斗机,在以色列的帮助下研究如何击败这架战斗机。

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The stealth fighters itself on its own are not going to be any use. but the use of artificial intelligence and the superior technological capabilities will be important!where J-20 loses out is the perhaps the lack of originality and the Chinese incapacity to introduce original concepts in aerial warfare, given the state of technological advancement that they have reached

隐形战机本身没有任何用处。但是人工智能和优越技术能力的使用是非常重要的!即使J-20达到了先进的技术水平,它的失败之处或许就在于缺乏独创性,而且中国人无法在空战中引入原创概念。

 

Rahul Funde, Editor

Updated Nov 15

See Because it was not made to scare Indian Air Force. It is part of Arm's race between USA, China and Russia. We aren't part of it. We are simple people who do yoga in morning and the walk dancing around the street to give tech support. Lol.

And even if IAF is panicked, they will tell defence ministry. Defence ministry will tell ADA. Then ADA will say “Sorry. Please buy it from Russia or france ”. But this hasn't happened. We haven't purchased any fighter jet lately. MMRCA deal is decade older.

Leave it. While making LCA Tejas we acquired 45% composite mixure to use on surface of Aircraft. Imagine this used with stealth aviation of SU- PAK T50 and HAL AMCA, which are coming soon. And also according to CHINESE analyst India will outnumber USA in terms of 4.5 and 5th generation fighters. Chinese experts explain why India and Russia jointly develop FGFA although no one knows how. (They also believe agni 5 has range of 8000km. Thanks for telling us we thought it was 5000.)

Let's look at current issue, It is not a big deal to believe that the first squadron of J-20 is not coming on Indian border. Even currently they have few Su-30 MKK and J11 which are inferior to Indian Su30 MKI. And the difference is widened when Sukhois are equipped with Brahmos. Even on their aircraft carrier as wll they have J15 which could be countered by Mig 29k and LCAs. And much more than that their carrier is not attacking India. So there is no need to worry about it is as well.

因为J-20并不是用来吓唬印度空军的。这是美国、中国和俄罗斯之间军备竞赛的一部分。跟我们并没有关系。我们是一个简简单单的民族,早上做瑜伽,在街上边走边舞。哈哈。

即使印度空军觉得恐慌,他们也会告诉国防部。国防部会告诉防空署。然后防空署说:“对不起。请从俄罗斯或法国购买。”但这种事并没有发生。我们最近没有采购任何战斗机。中型多用途战斗机的交易10年前就进行了。

在制造光辉战斗机时,我们把45%的复合材料混合物用于飞机表面。想象一下,把这种材料用于苏-帕克T50和即将面世的哈尔-阿姆卡隐形飞机会怎么样。此外,据中国分析师称,印度将在4.5代和5代战斗机方面超过美国。中国专家解释了印度和俄罗斯为什么要联合研发烟气脱硫装置,尽管没有人知道具体原理。(他们还认为烈火5的射程为8000公里。谢谢你告诉我们,我们还以为是5000公里)。

让我们看看当前的问题,J-20的第一个中队应该是不会进入印度边境的。即使是现在,他们的几架苏-30 MKK和J11也不如印度的苏-30 MKI。等到苏霍伊装备上布拉莫斯导弹时,这种差距还会继续扩大。更何况,他们的航空母舰上配备的J15,也会被米格29k和LCAs制衡。不仅如此,他们的航母并没有攻击印度。所以没有必要担心这架战斗机。

 

Aswin Ottapilavil

Answered Dec 16, 2016

Am really glad that none of the answers here went the usual route of “Its Chinese product, its incapable blah blah”. Believe me, the J-20 is no joke and is definitely a really formidable weapon system in every sense. China possessing such advanced aircraft is definitely a threat to any country that goes confronts PLAAF in the future.

But the biggest reason IAF isn’t much concerned about it is that China is not a natural enemy of India and Chinese advancements in military is never been targeted towards India in a least bit.

Secondly, even thought its already been handed over to the air force, J-20 is not yet completely optimized to perform in its full potential. It will take few more years for J-20 to completely spread its wings. As China already stated its a system for future and India have more than enough time to catch up with that and induct our own 5th gen alternative (FGFA or AMCA) and even better surface based defense systems to counter its threat.

I think J-20’s are probably gonna be assigned for scouting missions especially the South China Sea region and probably taunt Japan and US a bit. Another possible way it’ll be used is to intercept US or Japanese aircraft in the region and maybe show off a bit. I don’t see them being stationed near Indian border at least for now.

hope it helps :)

我真的很高兴没有看到老生常谈的答案“那是中国产品,所以性能不佳”。相信我,J-20不是闹着玩的,从任何意义上说,它都绝对是一个非常强大的武器系统。中国拥有如此先进的飞机,对任何未来可能与中国人民解放军空军对战的国家来说都是一个威胁。

但印度空军对此不太担心的最大原因是,中国不是印度的天敌,中国在军事领域的进步从来没有针对过印度。

其次,即使它已经进入空军服役,J-20也尚未完全优化,发挥出全部潜力。J-20还需要几年时间才能完全鲲鹏展翅。正如中国的声明,这是未来的防御系统,印度有足够的时间迎头赶上,推出我们自己的第五代飞机,甚至更好的地面防御系统来对抗J-20的威胁。

我认为J-20可能会用于执行侦察任务,特别是在南中国海地区,可能会挑逗一下日本和美国的神经。还有另一种可能,J-20会拦截该地区美国或日本的飞机,或许还会炫耀一下自己的实力。至少目前我没有看到他们驻扎在印度边境附近。

希望对你有所帮助

 

Mark Thomas Vetter, Well read at least

Answered Apr 8, 2017

First there are no true stealth aircraft. The technology is called low observable and it reduces the radar footprint of the aircraft making it much harder to detect. India has a well organized and professional military, the air defense organization has sufficient radars, communications, and munitions to counter air attacks, no matter how low observable the enemy aircraft are. One weakness of stealth aircraft is that they are just as visible to radars in the VHF band as any other aircraft. This means that interceptors can be guided by ground controllers or AWACS in to the area where the J-20 is close enough so that the low observable doesn’t help much. The J-20 could fly at very low altitude to go under the radar, but this will greatly reduce the range of the J-20 as it has to plow through the thick air near the surface. Plus going through the air at low altitude heats up the surface of the airplane making it more vulnerable to infrared detection.

首先,世界上并没有真正的隐形飞机。这种技术被称为低可观察性,它减少了飞机的雷达足迹,使其较难被探测到。印度有一支组织有序的专业军队,无论敌机的能见度有多低,防空部门有足够的雷达、通讯和弹药来反击空袭。隐形飞机的一个弱点是,它们和其他飞机一样,可以被VHF波段的雷达观察到。这意味着拦截器可以由地面控制器或预警机引导到J-20足够接近的区域,因此低可观察性没有多大用处。J-20可以在非常低的高度飞行,避开雷达的侦查范围,但这将大大减少J-20的活动范围,因为它必须穿过接近地表的浓厚大气。此外,在低空穿越空气会使飞机表面升温,使其更容易被红外探测仪发现。

 

Samved Iyer, Keen interest to fly for the Indian Air Force. Studying a lot about it.

Updated Feb 10, 2017

Because J-20 is a total joke. I never heard of stealth aircrafts having canards (the two mini-wings at the front of an aircraft thay increase lift capacity and manoeuverability. Check out a Sukhoi SU 30Mki).

If a fighter aircraft has canards, it can be very well detected by enemy radars. Stealth aircrafts shouldn't have canards.

And don't worry, because Indian Air Force aircrafts have excellent radars and so they would just scoff at J-20.

EDIT: People are mentioning about some aircrafts having canards but are still stealthy. I forgot to add in my answer one more thing. If you need a military aircraft to be stealthy despite having canards, then the radar cross section of that aircraft should be insanely small. That is not the case with J-20. Compare it with F-22 Raptor anf you'll realize. Low radar cross-section means that your aircraft will appear tiny on enemy radars.

因为J-20完全是个笑话。我从未听说过哪种隐形飞机会有鸭翼(飞机前部的两个微型机翼,可以增加升力和机动性)。看看苏霍伊苏30Mki吧。

如果战斗机有鸭翼,它会很容易被敌方雷达探测到。隐形飞机不应该有鸭翼。

别担心,因为印度空军飞机装配了出色的雷达,所以他们藐视J-20。

编辑:人们提到一些飞机有鸭翼,也隐形。我忘了在我的回答中补充一件事。如果你需要一架军用飞机在有鸭翼的情况下保持隐身,那么飞机的雷达截面积应该非常小。但歼-20并非如此。与F-22猛禽相比,你会发现。低雷达横截面意味着你的飞机在敌人的雷达上显得很小。

 

Rahul Kardam, Entrepreneur, Web-Developer and an investor at heart.

Answered Jul 11, 2018

Simply because Indian Air Force feels stealth technology as we know it now will be obsolete in next 10–15 years. And i don’t totally disagree with IAF planners too.

See the concept of stealth was born to defeat enemy aircraft detection system. But the concept has been around for more than 2 decades now, and has provided USA its full benefits. Its only now that news of Russian and Chinese radars capable of detecting stealth aircraft are coming in. Within those next 10–15 years, those radars will become more prominent , and will start showing up all around the globe.

This is more of a history repeats itself moment to me. Think of it the time when there were military planes and no radars (in the first half of 20th century). The problem of detecting planes was solved by invention of Radar. Stealth may have changed the nature of the problem a little , but it is essentially the same problem. There are “some” planes which we can’t detect using regular radars, its only a matter of time tech will come up to detect these planes and will proliferate. And the tech has already come up, it just needs time to proliferate.

原因很简单,印度空军认为隐形技术将在未来10-15年内过时。我对印度空军规划师的观点也存在相同之处。

隐形的概念是为了打败敌机探测系统而诞生的。但这个概念已经提出20多年了,为美国带来了丰厚的利润。现如今,俄罗斯和中国的雷达能够探测到隐形飞机的消息才开始出现。在未来的10-15年内,这些雷达将越来越精密,将开始出现在全球各地。

对我来说,这更像是历史再度重演。想想那个没有雷达,但有军用飞机的时代(20世纪上半叶)。雷达的发明解决了探测敌军飞机的问题。隐身可能稍微改变了这个问题,但本质上还是相同的。有“一些”飞机我们无法用常规雷达探测到,迟早会有新技术探测到这些飞机并推广扩散。这项术已经出现了,只是需要时间来扩散而已。

 

Anonymous

Answered Sep 3, 2016

You already have the answer. Because they are “Made in China” . Just kidding

1.Chinese are specialists in reverse engineering. But they have copied F22 structure and that doesn't mean they know how to replicate its STEALTH which is very essential otherwise China’s J series is just another ‘Made in Chinaware’

2.The Platforms operational capability and technical specifications are not yet disclosed or even tested for the fact

你已经知道答案了。因为它们是“中国制造”的。我只是开个玩笑。

1.中国人是逆向工程方面的专家。他们复制了F22的结构,并不意味着他们知道该如何复制它的隐形能力,这是非常重要的,否则中国的J系列只是又一种“中国制造”的商品。

2.战斗机的操作性能和技术规范还没有公开,甚至还没有经过测试

 

Legion Vlad, worked at Business

Answered Apr 30, 2017

No professional army, airforce, navy will show sign of panic. India is also on the path of acquiring its own stealth jet thru a joint vanture with Russia. India dont have any reason to be concerned and china dont have any reason to attack.

People only show their narrow mindeness when they assume based on hearsay. It serves no purpose assuming that chinese pilots are inexperienced flying jet planes, Chinese can't build jet planes etc. No sane airforce will allow a inexperienced pilot to fly its multi million war plane.

真正的陆军、空军、海军是不会表现出恐慌迹象的。印度也在通过与俄罗斯的联合军演获取自己的隐形战机。印度没有理由担心,中国也没有理由攻击印度。

人们只有在道听途说的时候才会表现出狭隘的心胸。假设中国飞行员没有驾驶喷气式飞机的经验,中国人无力制造喷气式飞机,这些都是毫无意义的。任何一支理智的空军都不会让一个没有经验的飞行员来驾驶价值数百万美元的战机。

 

Prateek Gourav, Quamtom Scientist and Mythology at Research (2015-present)

Answered Dec 31, 2017

india Will Also Have 5th Generation fighter. PAK FA. This Will Be 5th Generation Fighter For india. Russia and India have Collaborate For This. This will Ready from 2025-28. This Will Capable To Destroy J-20 or Any Jets.

India is Also Developing HAL FGFA Which Will Complete in 2030. India is Still Capable For J-30 With its Advance SU-30. Rafale coming Shortly. S-400 Will Deploy in 2020. This is A Defence System Capable To Detect And Destroy J-20

印度很快也将拥有第五代战斗机。PAK FA。这会是印度的第五代战斗机。俄罗斯和印度为此进行了合作,将于2025年至2028年完成,可摧毁J-20或任何战机。

印度也在开发印度航空第五代战斗机,将于2030年完工。印度可以用先进的苏-30对抗J-30。“阵风”很快就能交付。S-400将于2020年到位。这个防御系统能够探测并摧毁J-20。

 

Ashraf Chopan, works at Self-Employment

Answered Jul 30, 2017

Why should an entire Air force fear a single weapon system anyway? J-20 has made IAF uneasy because China has leapfrogged every Asian force here and its advantage in air is very much established now. J-20 as an addition to already formidable line up of advanced aircrafts of PLAAF is a causeof worry for all including US, this is what they have to say about J-20

为什么空军都要害怕区区一个武器系统呢?J-20让印度空军感到不安,是因为中国已经超越了亚洲所有军队,而且现在中国在空中的优势已经非常明确。J-20作为中国人民解放军强大的先进战机阵容的补充,让包括我们在内的所有人都感到担忧,这就是他们对J-20的看法。

 

Sterling Saini, Military Enthusiast

Answered Jun 4, 2018

Why should they fear the J-20?

Indian Su-30 MKIs have been able to track it with radar.

Indian Su-30 MKIs are faster, have 3D vector thrust, and better avionics. There is no reason to fear it…

他们为什么要害怕J-20?

印度苏-30 MKIs已经能够用雷达跟踪到J-20。

印度苏-30 MKIs的速度更快,具有3D矢量推力,航空电子设备性能也更好。我们没有理由害怕J-20……

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